Interplanetary Wipeout

Hey guys, it's time for another episode of Space Welders, episode 82, recorded Friday 2nd of June 2017. Interplanetary Wipeout with your hosts Mike Wise and Steve Rogers and it's very interesting. Hang ten bro. It's suddenly, winter decided just to go winter and it's on.

It's like a switch, you just woke up this morning and just went winter, that's it. I mean that's just Queensland and Brisbane specifically for you, isn't it? Yeah, well we can't really winch for our international listeners. It's cold though, global warming, that's not a thing, it's cold outside today.

It's cold. Obviously global warming is false. Clearly global warming is false as Trump says FU to the world and travels off in his own little direction claiming that he works for Pittsburgh and you know, apart from the clear and obvious statement that the entire rest of the world is on the other side, heading in a direction towards clean energy and believing in clean energy is actually a real thing and if you look at what Germany's doing, it's most certainly for them. Yeah but Mike, think about the jobs.

They're moving forwards. What about the jobs and the cost and the economy? We can't have that. We've got to be short-sighted.

We have to look two years in the future, not 20. That's true. Don't be ridiculous. What will happen in the next election?

It's all about now. Speaking about now, Steve, right now, and it feels like we're a bit of a, you know, what show is currently going on type show, but Computex is on. Computex 2017 in fact. The interesting things about Computex at the moment, and you've probably been reading your favourite hardware guide, Tom's hardware for me has been a mainstay since, well, gee, the early late 90s, I think, when it was first, the internet was first getting its shit together and Tom's hardware used to just be the place to go and follow your favourite hardware topics.

These days it's more of a, like a buyer's magazine of bits and pieces, but you always went to Tom's hardware for reviews on motherboards and, you know, they used to do the initial reviews of G-forces and all the different video cards that you could possibly get. I just blindly trust whatever Linus tells me. Yeah, we're all... Lord Linus.

Lord Linus. We appeal to Lord Linus and his tech tips site, but these days, you know, there's, at the moment, Computex is still on. It's actually quite a lengthy conference actually. It's going for a couple of days.

It's from May 30 through to the 3rd of June in Taipei Nang Exhibition Centre in the Nang District in Taipei, Taiwan, if you wanted to know. But what happens there is everybody's got together. All of the hardware manufacturers have come together and said, hey, let's show off our wares for this year and talk about some new things. And definitely there is a significant roundup of equipment and there's a few things that caught my eye as I read it, but I'll just do a quick rundown of sorts of things, Steve, if you're interested.

If you want to know what was that... Sure. Mike, what was at Computex this year? Well, Steve, at Computex, there was a launch of externally powered GPUs which turbocharge your graphics laptop, which has already been around.

In fact, Linus did a review of two different types of external GPU graphics cards, but here we go. There's another one that's available called the, and it's got a very strange name, it's Aorus. It sounds like anus, but anyway, it's just a box, a big box that you stick next to. Well, the chick that died in Final Fantasy.

Who was that? Aorus? Was it Aorus? Oh yeah, could have been.

Wasn't she the one that died? Maybe. Spoilers for like Final Fantasy 7 or something, by the way. Sorry, if you're just starting the 25-year-old game now, Aorus dies.

Well, Jensen from Nvidia was there and talking about, you know, moaning about Moore's Law and, you know, we can't stuff more transistors in and we have to make a bigger wafer. A waffer! The big news was AMD Vega, so they've got a bunch of new chipsets with the Ryzen chipsets and the CPU and just whacking more cores and everything, and they came out with a really cool name for their CPU series, they called it a Thread Ripper. So they've got the AMD Thread Ripper.

Isn't that usually a bad thing? What's that? I don't want my threads ripped, I want my threads parallelized and working in harmony. I mean, how many times have you played a game where it's like CPU 0 is doing all of the work?

Yeah, well, we're getting into Gigaflops processing with more cores and then stuffing more cores into them, so you're getting octocore performance and, you know, we're trying to get up to around 36 cores if you've got the cache device, that sort of thing, in a desktop itself. I'm not totally certain. If you're just browsing the web with 36 cores, there's something that you're doing, probably porn. But imagine the Australian version of that, it'd be the Arse Ripper.

The Arse Terror. Arse something. Anyway, Snapdragon were there talking about... The Arse Ripper is something entirely different.

That's in the conference down the road. So Qualcomm were there, obviously staring down Apple, growling at each other. They've got the Ryzen Thread Ripper from AMD, you know, it's got 16 cores, 32 threads, quad-core DDR, and they're giving it sort of all sorts of specs. I'm pretty sure that there are every laptop imaginable or version imaginable there, where they've got ones with Windows 10 convertible ones.

Obviously monitors and gaming monitors, getting up, you know, to the unbelievable refresh rates that are required. Asus have been bringing out some great monitors recently. Video cards, of course. Keyboards.

I love my keyboard, you know, a Cherry keyboard set. Cherry keys in my keyboard. I think mine are... What are they?

I always get them wrong. Clears. No. Browns.

Blues. Cherry something. It sounds like this. If you know the sound of that, then tell me.

You can just... Right in. Right in. So MSI were there, everybody and their dog was there.

But the other really interesting thing, apart from Nvidia and all the gang, is Intel. Now Intel have released a new series of processors, the Core X processor, and it's capable of going to... Well, they've got 36 cores, and it's going to be that kind of enterprise beast. But they have a new i9 CPU.

So we've got the i7, Steve, but we've now got the i9. I just bought one. God damn it. Don't you always buy one just before a new thing comes out?

I just got a Pentium. So they've got this 18-core CPU, and it's got variable sorts of capacity inside of it. But is that really useful? I mean, the i7 is not really that necessary for most people.

Most people can get away... If you're a gaming PC, you can get away with an i5. Well, they're saying scalable and accessible desktop platform for an enthusiast community. Yeah, but it's pointless.

I mean, the i7 is fairly pointless. The only reason you really need an i7 now, let alone an i9, is if you're doing significant multi-threading applications, things like video rendering, audio rendering, and if you just want to be cool. But your tools, like video processing tools, obviously use these. But even then, they mainly use the GPU anyway.

They don't really use the CPU, unless they're using a lot of plugins. When you do video and audio editing, a lot of plugins, especially the compressors and things, use the CPU more than the GPU for rendering. But even then, most people can get away with the i5. So this is like, well, I mean, it's the jump, isn't it?

And then it's in five years, people will be using the i9 rather than the i7. So it's just pushing the envelope yet further. But another interesting thing that they brought to the show, which no one had been really talking about, and I was joking with Steve like, have you heard of NUC before? So a NUC, which you may not know, is a next unit of computing or small form factor computing.

We've seen a lot of people with like itsy-bitsy tiny little computers running around the place, and everyone's got a NUC. Like even Apple had a NUC before a NUC was possible, if a NUC could chuck NUC wood. And the next evolution of this, which Intel thinks is pretty interesting, is called a compute card. It's basically a credit-sized card with an entire computer on it, with all the bibs and bobs that you'd ever need.

But the whole idea is that you walk up to a piece of plastic, you chuck your Intel compute card in it, and then you turn it on, and then you've got your laptop computer or whatever. So it's a phone? No, it's a credit card-sized computer. Well, it sounds like a phone.

Seems like it. Look, all right, so at the show, they answer people like you, and they said, all right, Steve, over here we have this thing called the Always Connected PC, which is a phone. Also a phone, yeah. It's essentially a PC phone.

I mean, combine a phone with the ability to have external graphics cards, as we said before, that they're bringing out. Maybe not an iPhone, but let's say an Android-y type phone. Generally, the processing power of a phone is good enough for basic net browsing and basic gameplay. So if you chucked it onto an external GPU to get some extra grunt out of it, then you're going to be fine.

So it's a phone. So a source at the show had a device called the Kahuna, and this Kahuna was a stylish laptop, but it was ready for a... well, this is always connected, so it's got LTE in it, so it has some kind of radio to connect to, you know, your favorite... But I mean, my PC now is always connected when it's on.

Radios. So what's the difference? What does always connected mean? It's just a big giant phone.

Everything is always connected these days. There's also, of course, virtual reality. We'll talk about a little bit more about VR in a moment, but there was plenty of people showing off new wares in VR and, of course, high refresh rates. Is it still a thing?

It is, yeah. It's huge. It's massive. AR is probably...

we've been talking about it for ages, VR. But Intel have some offerings there. I think the whole idea is to have a lot more performance to drive the sorts of experiences like VR. You need to get up to 90 frames per second type refresh for it to make it worthwhile.

We've always said the HoloLens style is where it should go, the AR mixed reality, because the problem with VR, you're putting the goggles on and you're losing everything, whereas if you have the... even the Google Glass was kind of a beginner at this, although that was very early technology, but at least that's what they were going for, a mixed reality rather than full virtual reality. I think virtual reality will probably end up being consigned to a gaming peripheral, really. I doubt it will ever really hit mainstream like a mouse or a keyboard.

We were looking this week, Steve, like you found this part of what we do, but Google Street View can now... they're now walking inside of premises. We've been doing that for years. Street View is combined with map.

You can drop a little man and then you can view the building. They've been doing a Street View walk into a building for years. They've got a way of certifying and selling the service, so you could have someone walk around your building. Anything to get a few extra bucks from Google.

Then you get a little badge that says Street View Trusted. Badges! Street View Trusted. That's how they get you.

How many brothels would have that today? Probably quite a few. So you'd want that. Street View Trusted.

I think Intel's offerings at the show were really interesting. Obviously AMD with their Threadripper, but then you've got Intel talking about a whole new generation of CPUs for us to go and write bad software for and crash and that sort of thing. The Core X processor and just lots more different ways to enjoy small form factor computing. So I think COMTEX is still on as we speak.

It ends tomorrow. I'm pretty sure that they'll all be very tired. It's still time. Oh no, wait.

No, it's still time in Taipei. So if you hop on the plane and drive over, you'll be able to see them. So Steve, today is interesting because basically the Paris Agreement and we were mentioning before that Trump had pulled out and, you know, there's many... Not in a good way.

Not in a good way. Screw you, I'm going home, in that sort of style of speech. Much to the disgust of every celebrity on the planet, much to the disgust of the French and everybody else. And, you know, when you've disgusted the French, you've done something wrong.

Yeah, I know. It's pretty hard to upset them. No, it's pretty easy to upset them, I'd say. Merci.

No, that's not the right one. So he's putting forward a number of arguments which is all about America first and jobs and it's interesting because on Twitter you saw from the White House themselves put out what would be, well, they put out press briefings and animated graphics to explain why this decision is justified, etc. But you could kind of say, well, he's just following... It's because they've got to explain it to their primary voter base, so pretty pictures and animations are the best way to do that.

So I think you'll see, well, Apple came out today and basically said, look, you know, Tim Cook, in fact, phoned Trump and said, look, in the best, probably nicest way, you shouldn't be really doing that and then actually had to, for his own employees' sake, say that he did call, he didn't get anywhere and, dear employees, you know, we're pulling out. Elon Musk is pulling off the technical board that he's put together. It's absolutely a PR disaster for any company that stands by him at the moment. So, as you say, Elon Musk has resigned from the Advisory Council.

The CEO of Disney, Bob Iger, has also resigned from the Advisory Council over this decision. There's been a coalition of mayors across the US who have formed a climate mayors group to support the Paris Agreement in their cities, even if the federal government isn't supporting it nationwide, particularly Pittsburgh, who Trump called out in his announcement, where he said he was governing for Pittsburgh, not for Paris, presumably forgetting the fact that Pittsburgh was 90% or 80% voted for Hillary Clinton in the election. So really, they didn't vote for him, they voted for the other person. It just rhymed.

You should have said Albuquerque. Just because it starts with P. Albuquerque. Albuquerque.

Should turn left. So, it's been interesting to see people's arguments against this, because the Paris Agreement, at its core, is non-binding. There's no legal impact to not meeting the targets. It's very much a, yeah, we've signed, aren't we?

Great. Are you actually going to do anything about it? Well, maybe. Listening to the contents of the speech, he basically said, no, we're pulling out because we want a better deal.

If there's a better deal, we'll get a better deal. Come with us and we'll get a better deal. The thing is, it's not a deal. There's no deal here.

There's an agreement. So the overall, the Paris Agreement, it's a goal of keeping average global temperatures from rising two degrees by the end of the century, which I suspect we're going to get there since we've risen like 0.8 or even one degree in the last 50 years or something like that. It's a non-binding agreement for countries to reach peak greenhouse gas emissions as soon as possible. So there's your out right there.

And it's a framework. It adds a framework to gradually become more aggressive in reducing their emissions. So almost every country is either a signatory or a party to the agreement. The only countries that are not are Nicaragua, because they did not agree with some of the goals, although they have said that they will be continuing to meet climate change themselves.

And Syria, because they are in the middle of a civil war. Now, if the US actually goes ahead and pulls out, they have to give a year's notice. So they won't actually withdraw until next year if they go ahead with it. He hasn't actually officially pulled out.

He has just announced to media, basically, that he is going to. So he's got like 30 days in writing? No, it's like a year from when you officially announced to the group that you are pulling out of the agreement. It's probably one of those clauses you think, ah, no one's going to take that.

Yeah. So the interesting thing that I've been seeing is a lot of reasonings why it's bad or why it's good that Trump has pulled out, why the agreement is bad. And most of them boil down to economic reasons, really. They don't boil down to environmental reasons.

It's because it's going to cost money to move from fossil fuels to renewable energy, which is the main thing. Some of the other reasons are that the targets aren't good enough, that Australia's target in particular is laughably small for the size of our country compared to the emissions that we put out and the fact that Australia is a first world country. So the percentage target for Australia is 1.4%. When you compare it to a country like Brazil, it's 2.4%.

China is 20% reduction. So Australia is laughably small for being a rich country, you'd expect that we would be able to reduce it much more. By the way, have you noticed there has been coal ads on the television recently? Yeah, there's one where he says, well, we're pulling out, we're going to renewable energies.

We have to do it. It's essentially because the coal price has dropped, the coal lobby, the coal industry lobby has started putting out ads, which their tagline is coal is Australia's future, which is ridiculous. It's like, well, it's not going to be there if most of Australia's capital cities are underwater in 50 years. So the other reason that people have against it, and I've been trying to find out using the sceptical part of me, trying to find out if this is a logical fallacy or not.

So I'd be interested if any dear listeners know. Whether this is or not, but it's an argument that Even if every country met their target it wouldn't Stop climate change from happening. So why bother at all is The argument that a lot of people are making so why should we bother spending money on something that isn't going to make? an Enormous difference So, I don't know if that's if there's a logical fallacy for that or if it's just a poor argument in general But that's getting past also the the facts that it is actually happening Like are we how we observe the point the point of this argument is that even if every country met their agreements under the Paris?

Agreement the it still wouldn't impact the global temperature rise by enough to offset What's already happening? So why bother doing anything at all? That's the argument now That's obviously a poor argument because as far as climate change is concerned. Something is better than nothing true and it gives you it gives you that start because once you start the biggest cost in moving to renewables is that initial movement and R&D once you have the technology and you have efficient solar panels and efficient wind turbines and And all of that then it becomes easier to grow that over time Yeah, I think also It's got a lot of small numbers like people are saying all it's only such as such an incremental degree change But it's it's actually a system of when you start studying Systems and moving systems and fluid dynamics and those sorts of things small very very incremental small changes do make a great impact That's not butterflies especially in a system as large as the earth different Yeah, when you talk about a hot when you talk about a half a degree change on the planet That's significant an awful lot because there's areas that are going to be much higher than that Already.

Yeah, so it Because it's got such small numbers. It's probably a difficult marketing target to try and convince people so getting past the number I think that's why I'm getting to the to the actual logical conclusion of why it would be I think that's why it's difficult because people say well yesterday was 25 degrees and today 22 degrees. That's three degrees right there Why should why are we bothering about one and a half and also? Perceiving the future as well.

So what would the future look like because most people don't understand You know sort of can't really see past You know the next couple of days let alone a year let alone Decades and the whole concept of leaving something for generations To be able to work out or to resolve so I think that it is complicated It's difficult because it's modern kind of marketing Speak as well because it was Lots of people are trying to do to get it get in and use it as a political tactic to stay in power or keep Power, but I believe the decision today will will obviously prove Trump wrong in the history And I think the majority of many of his decisions many of his decisions will will probably leave him leave him out So Steve prepare to be awed in or Is on in USA? Oh It is the 8th or Conference in the USA it is the largest IR and VR event in the world So it's in Santa Clara Convention Center, California We know different different kind of conference podcast we are from it's also at the same time as computers So I make that if could you imagine if there was a conference podcast conference? There's one pod con the con pod con we just review conference And I'll include links to the website because it has the most amazing graphic which Shows all the participating companies, which is pretty much bloody everybody If your little little thing is not on this little thing, then who are you in the AR world out of interest? You've got people who are speaking like old scoble the scobolizer is there if you didn't know who he was He was a big Microsoft II Kind of evangelist the type guy came out of the where's Wally it is sponsored posters, isn't it?

And and it's also a reminder that in the future people if you're going to put your face into a conference or presented a conference Try and get a decent picture. Don't put a picture of yourself in your wedding suit. Don't put yourself in a picture of affairs Okay. Yes, you're going to an AR VR conference and it's also good to show your allegiance by having that specific device strapped to your Head, but that does not make a picture but in this particular case this conference It shows that you've got enough money or pull not a HoloLens though.

Let's be honest. That's true. You've got the cash I love this. I'm loving every minute or every everybody's is coming out with with everything and I'd love to be there So we've got some some Australians in there showing their skills They've got the of course, there's going to be a web ninja turn up the you always have a surely There'll be a VR AR ninja.

Do you just put that on your LinkedIn? This is your skill VR ninja. Yep VR ninja Plenty of founders and folks who want to talk about the the sorts of tech that they're into and how they're Utilizing the new medium that is AR and VR coming together, but it is in fact the eighth or conference It's not all it's all It's not even ha so Yeah, it'd be interesting to see if they've got any kind of Presentations coming out of this if they're recording it at the moment Yeah, I've also got a story that ran on IGN this week There was an Australian company who's been doing so so so well, or they're a new VR startup, but they weren't in here or they were going to here So I'd like to give a shout out to the guys Vertigo, so it's a virtual reality game where you're sort of balancing on Beams and things walking around a city It seems to me like I don't know if it's oculus or vive or whatever Suited but you definitely need paddles the handheld thingies To make it work. But anyway, it basically puts you on Rooftops and gives you serious vertigo as the name suggests but it was the brainchild of Richard and Tony who are local people Steve We'll have to try and see if we can get them on the show and talk about their If you're listening if you're listening, let us know Okay, and if you know them tell them we'd love to talk to them about how they develop the game and what they've been doing in the whole concept of VR a Okay, but it's this whole plank experience and creating experiences.

They use the vibe hang handheld controllers. Anyway, I You know, it'd be really interesting but that Brisbane's got a Brisbane, Queensland, Australia world We've got a very You know active VR community and we've interviewed VR folks before on the show as you know So a big shout out to those guys. They got mentioned in IGN this week I'll have a link to the article and congratulations to them It takes a lot of hard bloody work to make software work as you know Steve So yeah, congratulations to them and augmented world expo. We'll probably see a little bit more out of that So keep your eyes peeled.

We'll have updates as we go So Steven follow-up news, we love our gravity waves Interplanetary wipeout Something new has happened. There's been another discovery and I know that vertacium mark has been Got further things to see look and see and do about gravity waves. What's happening with the gravity wave situation? Well, they found another one and Is it bigger than the other one?

That's it. I've just found one. All right. So it's a thing Is that not cool anymore?

No, it's not. All right, pack it up guys. Gravity waves aren't cool gravity waves Everyone's obsessed with the fidget spinners now. So gravity waves Cares gravity waves are like the fidget spinners of the universe So yeah, I mean, it's it's another it's another detection to further Cement that this is what's actually happening So again, it was at the the LIGO facility in the u.s at 10 11 minutes past 10 GMT on the 4th of January and they've just published the paper after a couple of months of Confirming and checking and writing and doing all of that stuff that they have to do Again, it's a murder of two black holes Murder merger merger.

It's a Moyad. It's a Moyad Merger Causing the ripples in space-time that we that was then detected by LIGO So it's very cool. It's it's just another another Confirmation that this is actually happening because it's science. You always need things to happen more than once It's the old joke of the scientist getting shocked Touching something.

It's like a normal person would stop touching it. But a scientist would go. I wonder if that happens every time Yes, it's kind of like that Bayesian effect thing where you have to have it happen more than once and not just realize like If you've the Sun came up in the morning and the next morning it didn't come up. What would happen?

so yes, it's it's actually quite good that we've got further confirmations of Gravity waves happening in our world. So also speaking gravity waves next week. That's very poor segue, but we'll take it Apple's WWDC is next week. So we're all waiting with bated breath For it's they're not announcing the the next iPhone there That's potentially in September that we'll see the iPhone whatever it is next date thing but what we're expecting is a refresh on all the operating systems next week and some discussion about hardware is the Expectation in the presentation It is I think maybe the last time that they'll be presenting in somewhere other than the circling space campus It should be ready for the next what I think that they'll do the iPhone next presentation from the space campus Surely or whatever.

They call it the first First yeah, the first thing. Yeah And so yeah, that's all that's all happening next week So people are very excited for that one. It's gonna be a very busy and good news week next week moving on to mediasty Wonder Woman Is now gracing the screens House of Cards and Twin Peaks? Seem to be the the topic talk of the town at the moment, but the Wonder Woman what it's meant to be good Strangely has been reviewing really well God and DC has made a good movie because That Schneider wasn't didn't direct it.

I think they don't they get that Zach's like it's not a great director He's causing the issues. So it's currently sitting at 93% on Rotten Tomatoes, which is this feels exceptional this feels like What were you saying? Um Captain America sort of the original people have been comparing it to the first Captain America So in that which is what they needed to do in the universe But not trying to rope in all the other people like Batman vs. Superman didn't need Wonder Woman in it Let's be honest.

No didn't need the flash in it So it's it's it's looking it's looking good I haven't seen it yet. Obviously. I don't know if it's even out in Australia because we get everything three months late I think John wick 2 is about to be released in theaters. Yeah, Australia I believe it's out on blu-ray is it in the u.s.

Yep so In comparison to other movies released this week Baywatch is 19% on Rotten Tomatoes Yeah, Kim Kim old. So if you have a choice go and see Wonder Woman. It's doing great business in North Korea ahead Yeah, and of course House of Cards Yeah, my wife and I are watching that I'm actually watching it this is like Keeping up with it. Um, it's it's it's like I either they either changed the story when Trump got elected and Rewrote some things or they've nailed it because it is it's it's very soon without with no spoilers but it It's incredible it's a gripping what the way that Kevin Spacey's acting and Robin, right is really good, too Hey, well Kevin's on telly the other day and they were asking him, you know, of course real life is now actually Worse or better than or more interesting than what you presented on I wouldn't say real life is more interesting Well, it's certainly more eventful eventful.

Yeah House of Cards just has better writers So that was Kev's Kev's retort was we just have better writers, which is probably true But they do a sensational job of producing that show It's just incredible for what it is like in terms of the budget size and and the storytelling that they get in They've only got about three sets. Yes In a car a car the Oval Office set and a couple of corridors Maybe a couple of exterior shots, maybe a crowd scene about it Yeah, so I think they they do a really good job and then lastly you've actually I've not started watching Twin Peaks But I think do it doesn't actually start with that theme change Does it have that theme tune no wait, maybe spoilers no That so here's the thing. I've watched the first episode or like the first episodes a double episode. It's an hour and a half It's technically two episodes.

So I've watched that I Can't do spoilers Because I don't know what the hell was going on So there's nothing I could say that could be a spoiler. Well, maybe that's the thing Maybe it is I could say something and it is a spoiler, but I don't know because god damn it's Confusing as hell They've got the red room where everyone talks backwards, but they're not talking backwards. They're talking backwards, but it's forwards. They've got like a box Is that a spoiler?

I don't know. Is it this time box? Is it like everything we loved before but it's like was to but did you love not knowing what the hell's going on? Yeah, I don't even know if it's good.

It was one of those really bad It was I don't know but it's one of those first shows like we experienced it with Westworld Where you were trying to guess what was going on and what would happen and how the character plots would I think it was? One of the arts would I think it was one of the first Serialized dramas. Yeah where you had to watch it from the beginning Because until that point dramas like soap operas were obviously around for a long time, but they were designed that After they might have a storyline that spans a few weeks, but there's never in a soap opera. There's never any Huge big overarching plot lines are there really everything kind of resets every every six weeks So if you come into it halfway through You only need to wait a couple of weeks and then you kind of with it But Twin Peaks was one of the very first shows where if you hadn't watched that from the beginning You're stuffed and it was a gamble because in the night early 90s when it aired that you didn't have obviously Netflix or Stan or any other streaming service.

Most people didn't have VCRs to even record it There wasn't really such a thing as syndication so there weren't even really repeats I think it was also the start of cinema TV as well. Not necessarily. Yeah, maybe event TV Because what TV that everybody watched yeah, and we talked about the next day Yeah, we were so Twin Peaks at the time was a huge risk for the network hence, why they stuffed it up in the second season and Screwed it up. But this is really it This this kind of has a feeling that Showtime has given David Lynch a camera and a crew and He's just gone out into the woods for six months shot a bunch of stuff and then they've kind of edited it together And I don't know what's going on but but that's the thing they're like David you've David Lynch the two words that make The show work like and he well and Mark Frost.

Yeah sure But you've got you've got this because they're both writing and create. It's a it's a product of both of them I'm both of those guys So that you know that obviously it's it's being tempered by the two personalities and thought processes that you know Creates the storylines and the narratives which make it so enjoyable because you can the good thing like Westworld was good because you knew it was in good hands like if you actually Spent the time felt good about spending time thinking about the relationships of the characters Understanding their motivations and then guessing something in the future that happened on that on that basis then That's the sort of feeling that you kind of like you're gonna kind of go. Oh, yeah Because I I got it in the first. Yeah, it's like it's like Sherlock Holmes or Sherlock at the moment Look, you know It's in good hands when you read this when you're watching it You know that you're being given the clues and you can work out the clues along the way the problem I have with this new season of Twin Peaks is in the first season.

It had a very defined goal That was who killed Laura Palmer. That was it who killed her and so that's what you were speculating well, so the whole season it was who killed her and All the other kind of secondary plot lines were largely just building up the the world we're world building weren't know the thing with the major and Get him getting abducted and the owls and the log lady and all the rest of that That's that was just traction that was just building up the world and giving people motivations and background The problem I have with this one is there isn't it so far. Anyway, there isn't a central Plot device like that. There is there's there's a woman is is found murdered But it's not she's not she's just some woman.

She's not this small-town Sweetheart like Laura Palmer was the sweetheart of Twin Peaks. She was the like Girlfriend of the the quarterback. She was the homecoming Queen the prom queen. She was loved by everyone She had the whole world at her feet Which is why it was so shocking to everyone in the town When she was found dead and she had the CD passed and and and well, that's what came out over time But she She appeared to be perfect.

Whereas the woman that's dead in the new season. We don't know anything about her she's just some woman in a in a shitty apartment room that's found dead and I don't even know if that's the main I doubt that's the main Point because it's not even in Twin Peaks Yeah, and and it's building up and this isn't really a spoiler the fact that Agent Cooper's coming back Everyone knows that he's in in in it I mean it takes until halfway through the second part of this that he even comes back on screen anyway, so I don't know if there's going to be a season-wide plot arc like finding out who killed Laura Palmer or if it's just going to be a continuation of the kind of Supernatural nurse that was the second half of season two, which wasn't that great? Let's be honest after they revealed who killed Laura Palmer Which I'm not going to say because that is definitely spoilers even if even though it's 25 years old It certainly went downhill After that. Yeah When the when the puzzle was solved to me we kind of worked out This is the storytelling style should have just finished there But they they had to do a certain number of episodes, but the network forced them to reveal the killer early So what were they to do?

That's true. It's being a killer. I don't know if that's a good segue either having a good day. Doctor Who, we haven't, we know it's on and we haven't spoken about it.

I've been watching it. Have you? It's good. So it has the production values in this season is through the roof.

It was Peter Capaldi's last season. Peter Capaldi's last season. We're telling you something you already know. You're sitting in a cubicle going I can see if we already know this.

Series 10 is where they're up to right now. Lie of the Land is the episode that's going to be airing this weekend or as you're hearing this it has already aired so you know the answers to it and they all died. And the really interesting thing about this is I watch it on ABC on iview. So I'm not sort of watching it on the Sunday night like event TV like everybody else.

But through the middle of the season I did and the beginning of the season I did and lo and behold there was Rovic Menace with Whovians. And so what I wanted to point out is that I had been, I wanted to talk about Whovians because we've been busy doing production development, production work and we didn't have a couple of episodes there for a while. But I had been watching Whovians and I found Whovians fascinating. I've yet to watch Whovians because the ads for it just seem like an ads for the Reddit thread.

Really. The post-episode Reddit discussion. Spoilers. Looks like the ads.

Spoilers. That's what it is. It is exactly that. I haven't even watched it.

Just guessing. It's like oh my god it's geek out about Doctor Who. One of the things about Who is theories and throwing theories around. Are they still trying to guess who's in the box?

I mean it's obvious who it is. Who is it Steve? It's Missy. Is it?

Obviously. Do you think so? Yes. And what leads you to this?

Because it's obvious. Because in the episode where she is killed, in inverted commas, the box is in the background of the scene. Oh so he stuffs her in there. It's her.

It's either her or it's another incarnation. It's the master. All right so we've kind of... Because the guy who's the guy that played the master for a couple of seasons before...

The dude who played Caesar. Yes and he was in Life on Mars. Who incidentally does the voice for In the Night Garden. Oh really?

I wouldn't know. I'm in there demographic so you know. John Sim. Yeah John Sim.

Who was the master for a couple of seasons. He is in this season. He's been in a trailer. Yeah.

So it's either the woman who played Missy or it is John Sim. The other guy. No John Sim. He was the master.

Yeah. It's him or Missy. Oh him yeah. Okay sure.

Yeah. Missy who was the master at the end of the previous season when it was like oh my god it's actually the master. All right. So it's one of those two.

This is obviously. This isn't even a spoiler. Obvious. There are Whovians out there listening to the welders going all right so Steve says...

Is this not obvious to anybody else? It could be. It's obviously the master. Right in other words.

It can't be anything else. Right. Well. I am putting my buck down.

I will eat my hat if it is not the master or some you know some regeneration or incarnation of the master. I think it's got something to do with regeneration because how are they. The reason why we're talking about this now. Well we've got a lead to Peter Capaldi's regeneration.

Four episodes to this or three episodes. We've got the Christmas episode. Oh no the Christmas episode usually isn't that. I was accounting for that but regeneration.

You've got a few episodes there now where you've got to decide how does he regenerate because he's at a point where he shouldn't technically. Is it 13th regeneration something. Oh they retconned that ages ago. Well yeah well sure yeah.

That's. Don't even worry about that anymore. That was that was like five years ago when they went shit we're getting to the end of that number that we said 30 years ago. But I do want to say.

I think they had like the Time Lords come and like kind of wave their hand and say oh don't worry about that. And the other was Time Lords can be chicks not dudes now. I think they always could be. All right so shouldn't they.

But congratulations to Whovians. Congratulations to Rove McManus. If it is not the master in there I am done. I think they should also release it as a podcast long like short format long format whatever.

I'm sure there's a 5001 Doctor Who podcast. Oh no but not one like this. Not one with Rove McManus. Say hi to your mum for me.

They won the show. So Rove if you're listening. Come on the show and debate. Flip your lights on and off.

Remember that. Wasn't that funny. No no no. Anyway so Doctor Who is progressing.

I just wanted to talk about Whovians because I think it's a great piece of Australian TV and a great idea. And it's event TV and it's very much like what we were talking about with the Neighbours girls. If they sort of had a TV show format what would it look like. Probably like that.

So I think that was fantastic. So Steve we've come to the end of the show. We've been very busy. We know that we've missed a few spots here and there.

It's because we've been developing and releasing production systems. One of our companies that we have and work for is a company called Travel Reel where we do 60 second videos for hotels and we put them on the interwebs and sell them. And we've produced a new fendagled system to allow people to buy those videos really easily. Anyway we will probably take snippets from our development adventures and try and cut them into the show as well so as to fill you in on sorts of things that we do for a living as we develop software.

So yes thank you very much for continuing to listen to us. Episode 82 it's a long journey and we'll keep on going and hopefully you have a good week. We've got to be near the end though surely. No.

Heat death of the universe. Are we there yet? Are we there yet? Int dot max.

Are we there yet? We should be having some guests coming up. We've been lining up a few people to try and talk to us on the show and some interesting guests they will be. So Steve if you wanted to have an accord with the Space Welders and build a pact where you could have some kind of multi-country agreement.

How would you sort it out? Because we would sort it out for you surely. If you want an accord with the Space Welders just invoke parlay and then we can chat. Damn parlay.

Is it control parlay? Is it a key? That sounds like a keyboard. Control alt parlay.

Command parlay for the Mac users. Yeah. Alternatively head over to www.spacewelders.com. You'll find the show notes for this episode with all the links to everything we've talked about.

You can inject in your opinion there in the comments. You can follow us on Twitter. twitter.com.spacewelders. Mike's on Twitter.

I'm on Twitter. twitter.com.spacewelders.com It's true, all of it. I'm on Twitter. twitter.com.spacewelders.com You can subscribe to the show and that's the best way to get the show because you're told when it happens otherwise it's really annoying to like check and then you forget and you miss an episode and I mean this Space Welders is like Twin Peaks.

If you miss an episode you're screwed. We play it backwards sometimes. Like the ongoing plot lines that we've got developed. It's so deep that no listener would ever be able to get it.

But you can subscribe on iTunes, Stitcher and SoundCloud. Just go to those services and do a search for the Space Welders while you're there. Leave a rating and a comment and a favorite and a share and a, I don't know, sticker. Leave a sticker.

Leave a Snapchat. That's still a thing, right? What sort of clean energy version of that? Of iTunes.

It's like iTunes powered by monkeys peddling bicycles. No, it's monks meditating. Yeah. If you have any questions, comments or feedback, good or bad, email us info at spacewelders.com.

Mike. So again, thanks guys. Also, if you've been following me for a little while I'll probably do some tweets. I'm back to building some hardware again.

So that's also keeping me busy. So it's Mike out. Steve out.